Is Jesus too liberal for Republicans?

@rajk999 said
I am quoting what Jesus says. You are quoting what your church preached based on a twisted version of Pauls teachings. Paul never used the expression 'born of the Spirit'

Christ says very clearly :
- that which is born of flesh is flesh
- that which is born of the Spirit is spirit [John 3]
- a spirit hath not flesh and bones. [Luke 24]

Your church has twisted what Paul said and called it 'born of the Spriit'.

You admitted that Paul and Jesus didn't disagree, it doesn't matter if they didn't use the exact same words to say the same thing. We need the Spirit of God to be born again, by the Spirit of God, who was promised to us by Christ. Walking in the flesh we cannot please God, and one without the Spirit of God does not belong to God. If all you have is a fleshly life, then you are not God's, and clearly, without the Spirit of God you cannot even see the Kingdom of God so you are left with making it up as you go.

@kellyjay said
You admitted that Paul and Jesus didn't disagree, it doesn't matter if they didn't use the exact same words to say the same thing. We need the Spirit of God to be born again, by the Spirit of God, who was promised to us by Christ. Walking in the flesh we cannot please God, and one without the Spirit of God does not belong to God. If all you have is a fleshly life, then you ...[text shortened]... he Spirit of God you cannot even see the Kingdom of God so you are left with making it up as you go.

Paul and Christ did not disagree. They preached the same thing from different angles. In the end both preached that it is good works and righteousness that matters. All of the Apostles agreed with this and there are clear references that
- faith without works is dead
- a man is saved by works and not faith only
- those who continue to sin will not inherit the Kingdom of God
- Jesus abides in all who keep the commandments.
[ Paul was clear that these apply to born again Christian saints]

Faith for the Christian is just a vehicle that takes you to a place where you actually do good works. Failure to do good works leads to damnation Without good works your faith is useless.

Different words mean different things. If Paul used different words then he meant something else.
- what is born of the flesh is flesh
- what is born of the Spirit is spirit.
- as spirit does not have flesh and bones.
[ Not even Jesus was spirit [or born of the Spirit ] as he was flesh and bones

Paul never used those expressions. If a man is born of water he is born again, but that is not 'born of the Spirit'. Born of water = baptism and there are subsequent Holy Spirit gifts or indwelling of the Holy Spirit in the believer that enables them to prophesy, speak in tongues or do miracles. This is NOT BORN OF THE SPIRIT, because the born again Christian is still flesh and bones.

You need to stop arguing nonsense. The bible does not support your church interpretation of what Jesus and Paul preached. You are in error. Just shut up and leave it alone.

@rajk999 said
Paul and Christ did not disagree. They preached the same thing from different angles. In the end both preached that it is good works and righteousness that matters. All of the Apostles agreed with this and there are clear references that
- faith without works is dead
- a man is saved by works and not faith only
- those who continue to sin will not inherit the Kingdom of ...[text shortened]... interpretation of what Jesus and Paul preached. You are in error. Just shut up and leave it alone.

The most first things always come before those things that follow, and both Jesus and Paul had imperatives, Jesus gave us an imperative saying we must be born again (John 3:6-8), and Jesus said that those who do not believe are condemned already (Mark 16:16, John 3:18) Jesus saying we must abide in Him (John 15:4-6), Jesus saying He is the Truth, the Way, and the Life and that no one comes to the Father but by Him. (John 14:6) Jesus said the work of God is to believe in Him (John 6:29), Jesus said the Father sent Him and that whosoever looks to Christ the Son will be raised to eternal life. (John 6:40)

With the other writers of scripture the primary most important thing (1 Corinthians 15:2-4) our salvation rests on what Jesus did, not on what we do. (2 Timothy 1:9, Titus 3:5. This is not a declaration that works are not important, they are, but apart from Christ we can do nothing, we must abide in Him to do the works of God. That which is born of flesh is not going to be doing the work of God. Without faith, it is impossible to please God. (Hebrews 11:6) You pushing the notion those that who don't know the Lord are saved is not scriptural you must have the Spirit of God, being born again, or you are not God's. (Romans 8:9)

@kellyjay said
The most first things always come before those things that follow, and both Jesus and Paul had imperatives, Jesus gave us an imperative saying we must be born again (John 3:6-8), and Jesus said that those who do not believe are condemned already (Mark 16:16, John 3:18) Jesus saying we must abide in Him (John 15:4-6), Jesus saying He is the Truth, the Way, and the Life and th ...[text shortened]... not scriptural you must have the Spirit of God, being born again, or you are not God's. (Romans 8:9)

You are blind to the gaping holes in that doctrine, and it is nothing more than your church indoctrination. Here are the holes:

- Anyone to whom Jesus preached is doomed because Jesus never preached to people to believe in him neither believe in his death and resurrection.
- All the Jews prior to Christ are similarly doomed because they do not know Christ, neither professed faith in his death.

What Christians have done is to ignore the passages in the bible where it explains the good news of the arrival of Christ and that all people have been justified. This is what Grace is, the free gift of God to the world from Adam to the end of time.

Thankfully, your ridiculous church doctrine will not stop Jesus from welcoming all the righteous ie those who fed the hungry, clothed the naked etc etc, into the Kingdom of God. You will however be called to explain why you are misleading people the way the Pharisees did and who Jesus condemned as hypocrites.

@rajk999 said
You are blind to the gaping holes in that doctrine, and it is nothing more than your church indoctrination. Here are the holes:

- Anyone to whom Jesus preached is doomed because Jesus never preached to people to believe in him neither believe in his death and resurrection.
- All the Jews prior to Christ are similarly doomed because they do not know Christ, neither pr ...[text shortened]... plain why you are misleading people the way the Pharisees did and who Jesus condemned as hypocrites.

These must be from the book of that lying, deceitful, false prophet; rajk999, because there is nothing in scripture that backs this up. "- All the Jews prior to Christ are similarly doomed because they do not know Christ, neither professed faith in his death."

John 6:35
Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst.

John 10:25
Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in my Father's name bear witness about me,

John 12:44
And Jesus cried out and said, “Whoever believes in me, believes not in me but in him who sent me.

Psalm 30:3
O Lord, you have brought up my soul from Sheol; you restored me to life from among those who go down to the pit.

Psalm 84:2
My soul longs, yes, faints for the courts of the Lord; my heart and flesh sing for joy to the living God.

Matthew 16:16
Simon Peter replied, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

Matthew 22:32
‘I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not God of the dead, but of the living.”

Luke 20:38
Now he is not God of the dead, but of the living, for all live to him.”

Acts 10:42
And he commanded us to preach to the people and to testify that he is the one appointed by God to be judge of the living and the dead.

1 Corinthians 15:20
But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.

Exodus 33:19
And he said, “I will make all my goodness pass before you and will proclaim before you my name ‘The Lord.’ And I will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will show mercy on whom I will show mercy.

You have no idea what the living God can do, deceiver.

@rajk999 said
You are blind to the gaping holes in that doctrine, and it is nothing more than your church indoctrination. Here are the holes:

- Anyone to whom Jesus preached is doomed because Jesus never preached to people to believe in him neither believe in his death and resurrection.
- All the Jews prior to Christ are similarly doomed because they do not know Christ, neither pr ...[text shortened]... plain why you are misleading people the way the Pharisees did and who Jesus condemned as hypocrites.

Quote the church doctrine, tell me where you are getting your church doctrine so that you can this is what the church believes, LIAR, deceitful false witness to a different gospel than scripture proclaims. I quote scripture and you call it church doctrine, what a liar you are, steep in sin, altering the Word of God adding to it, and taking away from it so it fits your personal doctrine.

@kellyjay said
These must be from the book of that lying, deceitful, false prophet; rajk999, because there is nothing in scripture that backs this up. "- All the Jews prior to Christ are similarly doomed because they do not know Christ, neither professed faith in his death."

John 6:35
Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever beli ...[text shortened]... will show mercy on whom I will show mercy.

You have no idea what the living God can do, deceiver.

You really do not know how to make your point clearly. Obviously your mind is a muddled confused mess.

@rajk999 said
You really do not know how to make your point clearly. Obviously your mind is a muddled confused mess.

I'm not the one denying a clear straightforward reading of scripture that is you, and you two-faced liar, you have gone on and on about how Paul's words are less than in the past, and now you have changed your tune. Confused mess, that describes you and your half-truth doctrines.

@kellyjay said
I'm not the one denying a clear straightforward reading of scripture that is you, and you two-faced liar, you have gone on and on about how Paul's words are less than in the past, and now you have changed your tune. Confused mess, that describes you and your half-truth doctrines.

Pauls words are less than Christ. Yes I said that and I changed nothing.
I dont worship scripture. You do. So are you still in your flesh and bones state or have you been born of the Spirit and can move like the wind... lol 😉

Its amazing how the church can fool you people and make you believe something contrary to what Jesus said.

@rajk999 said
Pauls words are less than Christ. Yes I said that and I changed nothing.
I dont worship scripture. You do. So are you still in your flesh and bones state or have you been born of the Spirit and can move like the wind... lol 😉

Its amazing how the church can fool you people and make you believe something contrary to what Jesus said.

When Paul is moved by the Holy Spirit to write what God want’s said that is then the same source God. Didn’t you just acknowledge that? Jesus is Lord, between the two Jesus is far greater than Paul; however, even Jesus said what He had to say while He was walking as a man came from the same source, the Father. You do not get to belittle anyone who is speaking truth from God, putting one against another.

@kellyjay said
When Paul is moved by the Holy Spirit to write what God want’s said that is then the same source God. Didn’t you just acknowledge that? Jesus is Lord, between the two Jesus is far greater than Paul; however, even Jesus said what He had to say while He was walking as a man came from the same source, the Father. You do not get to belittle anyone who is speaking truth from God, putting one against another.

Says the man who refuses to accept these statements from the Word of God, Jesus Christ :
- that which is born of flesh is flesh
- that which is born of the Spirit is spirit [John 3]
- a spirit hath not flesh and bones. [Luke 24]

You promote the church doctrine, which by the way is rampant all over Christian churches that you are spirit, being born of the Spirit and you are still flesh and blood.

Jesus himself said he is not spirit, he is flesh and blood. But your pastor said you are born of the Spirit and you accepted that. You are gullible. Read the bible for yourself instead of listeneing to crooked pastors.

@rajk999 said
Says the man who refuses to accept these statements from the Word of God, Jesus Christ :
- that which is born of flesh is flesh
- that which is born of the Spirit is spirit [John 3]
- a spirit hath not flesh and bones. [Luke 24]

You promote the church doctrine, which by the way is rampant all over Christian churches that you are spirit, being born of the Spirit and you ...[text shortened]... pted that. You are gullible. Read the bible for yourself instead of listeneing to crooked pastors.

I accept everything in the context that it’s written in and your lack of understanding is evident when you speak about these things.

What church doctrine, what church are you referring to Baptist, Southern Baptist, Assembly of God, Vinyard, Methodist, Catholic, Church of Christ, Lutheran, Greek Orthodox, there are so many different ones, each with their own unique spins on this that and the other thing. Yet you are very specific in your charges without knowledge, deceiver once again you are lying, making false accusations, false, because you have no idea what you are talking about.

@kellyjay said
I accept everything in the context that it’s written in and your lack of understanding is evident when you speak about these things.

Do you then believe that there was a literal talking serpent in the garden of Eden?

Do you then believe that there will be literal multi headed beast which appears from the sea?

Do you then believe that there will be a literal whore riding said beast wearing a cloak which is dipped in the literal blood of Christian saints?

You probably do believe the first one, because you’ve been brought up to believe it, and you probably think the second and third are symbolic, because that’s what you’ve been brought up to believe.

But what about this one, also from Revelation…

Do you then believe that Jesus himself will literal be in hell overseeing the literal eternal burning alive of billions of non Christians?

Yes you do believe that, because you’ve been brought up to believe it.

You see KellyJay, you’re no different to Rajk999. You pick and choose what you think is literal, conceptual, allegorical and symbolic.

It’s called hypocrisy by the way. What you’re saying to Rajk999.

@kellyjay said
I accept everything in the context that it’s written in and your lack of understanding is evident when you speak about these things.

You actually do not accept this from Christ:
- that which is born of flesh is flesh
- that which is born of the Spirit is spirit [John 3]
- a spirit hath not flesh and bones. [Luke 24]

So you are deceiving yourself.

@rajk999 said
You actually do not accept this from Christ:
- that which is born of flesh is flesh
- that which is born of the Spirit is spirit [John 3]
- a spirit hath not flesh and bones. [Luke 24]

So you are deceiving yourself.

Your doctrine does not line up with the scriptures as it is written, you need to read it without alterations, as you constantly do by adding to, or taking away! I do not accept half-truths, deceiver, you are forever taking scripture out of context trying to make what you believe fit scripture instead of lining up with scripture to find what you need to believe. That which is born of flesh is flesh, not denying that, we are all children of Adam and this is what we need to be born of the Spirit, the second Adam, receiving the life that Jesus offers. Born again, you must be or you will not have the Spirit of God, you will be dead in your sins and will pay for each crime against deity and man you have ever done throughout eternity.