Living in Truth.

@secondson said
Look again Rajk.

Paul says, "Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ,.."

And then you say, "Faith in Christ and the avoidance of sin is what makes one justified".

Take a moment and compare the two statements. If you can't see how you've erred in comprehension, then you're still under the law, and not under grace.

The flaw in your conclusions is the result of not understand what FAITH IN CHRIST MEANS.

The faithful in Christ will not live in sin. Those who continue with a life of sin are not faithful to Christ, however much they profess their faith. Professions of faith are worthless if one continues to sin.

@FMF

I am talking about your frequent regurgitation of the ideas of Witness Lee and Watchman Nee rather than just posting some links to all that for anyone interested and then just having genuine conversations with members of this community instead. I'm not talking about Matthew. I am talking about your thousands of posts trotting out Witness Lee and Watchman Nee stuff available elsewhere online.

You're just mad that everyone else is not stumbling around in the dark not knowing what is what about life.

And Caljust says I'm preaching to the choir. He's just annoyed that it is not his choir.

He needs only then to formulate his own choir who love to hear him talk about what he thinks is important.

That's fair, Caljust. Just get a amen corner of your own. You have a few Jesus Mythicists here to be your own choir nodding at everything you say.

@galveston75 said
Perhaps your bible does not have these scriptures in it? I'm sure it does but you probably refuse to see it? Who knows????? Who cares????

"Jesus told his followers to “make disciples of people of all the nations.” (Matthew 28:19, 20) When he sent out his early disciples, Jesus directed them to go to the homes of the people. (Matthew 10:7, 11-13) After Jesus’ death, fir ...[text shortened]... hat Jesus said for his followers to do is this.... He has not yet told us to stop doing it!!!!!!!!!!

You can tear out whatever you like but all the words of Christ are not necessarily commandments applicable to us now. Some common sense will tell you that the command .. take up thy bed and walk .. does not mean for everyone to do. By all means take up you bed and walk around all day if you so choose but it does not count for anything..

Similarly the command in Matt 28 is specifically for the 11 disciples. Jesus took them apart from everyone else and issued these commands to them only to go out and preach. Of course you can do it if you so desire. What is flawed in your reasoning is your emphasis that this is a critical commandments for all of Christ followers. When the truth is that Jesus never preached this to anyone. Simple proof is that in all his preaching to many thousands and thousands he never repeats this command to go out and preach.

The commands that are critical for eternal life is to live righteously and do good works.

@galveston75 said
I'm sorry for your experiences with the JW's you have been around. Hopefully not all have been such a bad experience for you if you have come in contact with more of them.
We are not perfect at all. I'm living proof of that.
But without hearing what they said or why they said it I'm at a disadvantage.
Jesus did warn the congregations that as time went on "oppressi ...[text shortened]... it works. I know the Mormons do believe in such a process like that. Could be who your thinking of.

Thank you for that. And no, not all my personal experiences with Jehovah witnesses have been negative.

@rajk999 said
You can tear out whatever you like but all the words of Christ are not necessarily commandments applicable to us now. Some common sense will tell you that the command .. take up thy bed and walk .. does not mean for everyone to do. By all means take up you bed and walk around all day if you so choose but it does not count for anything..

Similarly the command in Ma ...[text shortened]... preach.

The commands that are critical for eternal life is to live righteously and do good works.

So only the apostles huh? Not so: Luke 10: 1-22 says differently.

https://www.jw.org/en/publications/books/jesus/ministry-in-judea/sends-out-70/

But Jesus clearly said to do this "earth wide" in every country. So common sense would tell you those apostles could never do that ever by themselves. Plus they died. So in order for this command from Jesus to be done and fulfilled, it would have to be done by an army or huge amount of people. Again the question was asked "how would they learn without someone to teach them" which is speaking of all humans on the planet. The best, most productive way and the most personal way is doing as Jesus said and did himself and that was to go town to town and door to door.
But hey, don't worry about it. We've got this. If you feel secure in your non teaching work life and just living righteously and doing whatever it is you feel good doing kind of status thingy , that's OK with me. We will take care of this for you....

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Thank you for that. And no, not all my personal experiences with Jehovah witnesses have been negative.

You are welcome. I have seen many so called Witnesses come and go. Most do no harm and being a Witnesses was just not for them. But every now and then someone comes in that can cause damage in many ways such as what they may say to someone like in your experience you spoke of and even in rare instances have had to be escorted out of the Hall or even had to be removed by police. Some even just travel the country knowing that most JW's are very willing to help when one of our brothers are down and out. But some are not JW's or may be dis- fellowship but still pose as ones who are in good favor with the congregations. But they aren't and have taken advantage of many JW's in taking money that they will never payback and then move on to the next congregation to do the same scam..

@galveston75 said
So only the apostles huh? Not so: Luke 10: 1-22 says differently.

https://www.jw.org/en/publications/books/jesus/ministry-in-judea/sends-out-70/

But Jesus clearly said to do this "earth wide" in every country. So common sense would tell you those apostles could never do that ever by themselves. Plus they died. So in order for this command from Jesus to be done ...[text shortened]... you feel good doing kind of status thingy , that's OK with me. We will take care of this for you....

In the Luke account, Jesus speaks specifically to SEVENTY disciples, just like in the Matt 28 passage he speaks to ELEVEN DISCIPLES. By all means go ahead and do likewise. However to tell others that they must do like you and the JWs, otherwise they will burn in hell, means that you have failed to understand the teachings of Christ.

I repeat that nowhere during Jesus ministry while preaching to the multitudes did he state this commandment which you think is so critical. Clearly your doctrine is not of Christ.

@sonship said
You're just mad that everyone else is not stumbling around in the dark not knowing what is what about life.

I don't have any problem at all with what is what about life.

@sonship said
@FMF

Beloney.

I quoted Matthew 5:19 with some explanatory comments most likely.

And blaming my use of HTML is beyond lame.

"Blaming" your use of html? What are you on about?

You suggested that you could be rewarded and therefore have some kind of more senior position in "Heaven" as a recognition of all your posting here which you seem to think were or are Christian 'good works'.

@sonship said
And Caljust says I'm preaching to the choir. He's just annoyed that it is not his choir.

He needs only then to formulate his own choir who love to hear him talk about what he thinks is important.

That's fair, Caljust. Just get a amen corner of your own. You have a few Jesus Mythicists here to be your own choir nodding at everything you say.

You once famoulsly claimed that hundreds of people reading threads on this forum might face torture for eternity having been exposed to my posts. Do you see yourself as "saving" hundreds of people on this website from being tortured by your God because of what you post?

@FMF

You suggested that you could be rewarded and therefore have some kind of more senior position in "Heaven" as a recognition of all your posting here which you seem to think were or are Christian 'good works'.

No I didn't. You're full of a lot of twisted crap.
A SICKO !

I think I know what you're up to. I think you are trying to provoke me to lose my temper to build up a paper trail to recommend I be banned from the Forum.

I think every time you get under my skin and I react strongly, you collect those samples.

That's what I think you're up to. I notice how you like to talk about other posters who have left the Forum. You like to keep kicking them, comparing others TO them.

@sonship said
I think I know what you're up to. I think you are trying to provoke me to lose my temper to build up a paper trail to recommend I be banned from the Forum.

Who wants to "recommend" that you are "banned from the forum"? What on Earth are you on about?

@FMF

Who wants to "recommend" that you are "banned from the forum"? What on Earth are you on about?

No? Okay then let me be frank. You're full of a lot of twisted crap.

I have discussed "great in the kingdom" and "least in the kingdom" ACCORDING TO the words of Jesus Christ in Matthew 5:19.

That is the only thing I can conceive of you referring to in your twisted slanderous way.

YOU can paste in or link to what you imagine took place.

And stop referring to other posters who are no longer here, to say "You remind me of this one" and "You remind me of that one."

What on earth are you babbling on about ?
Some kind of guilt by association?

@rajk999 said
The flaw in your conclusions is the result of not understand what FAITH IN CHRIST MEANS.

The faithful in Christ will not live in sin. Those who continue with a life of sin are not faithful to Christ, however much they profess their faith. Professions of faith are worthless if one continues to sin.

I agree in principle with what you are saying. Grace is not a license for sin. Everybody knows that except for a few reprobates.

BUT, justification is an act of God, and is in no wise contributed to by any work of the flesh.

Consider Ephesians 2:1-6
And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved😉
And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Nowhere in that passage is there even an inkling of the idea that a man has anything to do with being "quickened".

All the work of salvation, which includes justification, sanctification and the imputation of righteousness is done by God Himself on our behalf by grace alone, and not by any human effort.

@rajk999 said
In the Luke account, Jesus speaks specifically to SEVENTY disciples, just like in the Matt 28 passage he speaks to ELEVEN DISCIPLES. By all means go ahead and do likewise. However to tell others that they must do like you and the JWs, otherwise they will burn in hell, means that you have failed to understand the teachings of Christ.

I repeat that nowhere during Jesus min ...[text shortened]... id he state this commandment which you think is so critical. Clearly your doctrine is not of Christ.

OH Rajk, do as you feel and we will do as we feel. But no where once have we ever said one will burn in hell if they don't go door to door. That's a really lame statement.
But the bible is clear on what Jesus said to do. So again go ahead and do your thing, but you have no right to condemn us for doing exactly what Jesus said to do. If we are wrong at least we've made the effort to go out to the world and share the bible that would never hurt anyone. If you are wrong......?????

Do you understand this illustration from Jesus? Luke 19: 12-24

12 So he said: “A man of noble birth traveled to a distant land to secure kingly power for himself and to return. 13 Calling ten of his slaves, he gave them ten miʹnas and told them, ‘Do business with these until I come.’ 14 But his citizens hated him and sent out a body of ambassadors after him to say, ‘We do not want this man to become king over us.’
15 “When he eventually got back after having secured the kingly power, he summoned the slaves to whom he had given the money, in order to ascertain what they had gained by their business activity. 16 So the first one came forward and said, ‘Lord, your miʹna gained ten miʹnas.’ 17 He said to him, ‘Well done, good slave! Because in a very small matter you have proved yourself faithful, hold authority over ten cities.’ 18 Now the second came, saying, ‘Your miʹna, Lord, made five miʹnas.’ 19 He said to this one as well, ‘You too be in charge of five cities.’ 20 But another one came, saying, ‘Lord, here is your miʹna that I kept hidden away in a cloth. 21 You see, I was in fear of you, because you are a harsh man; you take what you did not deposit, and you reap what you did not sow.’ 22 He said to him, ‘By your own words I judge you, wicked slave. You knew, did you, that I am a harsh man, taking what I did not deposit and reaping what I did not sow? 23 So why did you not put my money in a bank? Then on my coming, I would have collected it with interest.’
24 “With that he said to those standing by, ‘Take the miʹna from him and give it to the one who has the ten miʹnas.’i