Living in Truth.

@caljust said
H dive - I realise that it is very dangerous for a third party to get involved in a dog fight - I might get bitten myself!

But seriously, why is this question important to you? It’s almost the same as the question: have you stopped beating your wife.

Case A: He says no, it isn’t. That makes JWs an exclusive sect. So what? How many other Christian posters here have issue ...[text shortened]... eriously!) not sure what you would gain by either answer, and why you are pushing him into a corner.

What “dog fight”? What are you on about? This is a discussion board where people disagree all the time.

My question to Galveston75 is a key turn of of his integrity in his posting and is laser beam aimed at the JWs being a cult and him not wishing to answer any question which reveals it as such.

Galveston75 will turn up here every few months (a bit like yourself in that respect) and start posting middle-of-the-doctrinal-road Christian sounding platitudes as he has in this thread and I am usually around to pick out the metaphorical sweet corn and ask him a question which goes to straight to the heart of his core belief - that in order to experience the next life a person MUST be a Jehovah’s Witness, they must join the organisation itself. Everything else is secondary.

@Galveston75 said:
“Satan is "the ruler of this world" which the bible clearly says. You are either a subject of this world and it's ruler, or you are a subject of Jesus and his Kingdom that the bible clearly describes and the one that will soon destroy the Kingdom of Satan at Armageddon.”

Sounds generally legit, right? Until you ask him this:

@divegeester replied:
”Galveston75, is it possible to be “subject to Jesus and his Kingdom” as you describe it here, without being a member of the Jehovah’s Witness church? “

And then the obfuscation starts, and now you know why.

@divegeester said
What “dog fight”?
”Galveston75, is it possible to be “subject to Jesus and his Kingdom” as you describe it here, without being a member of the Jehovah’s Witness church? “

And then the obfuscation starts, and now you know why.

Of course, you are right about this being a discussion board where people disagree all the time.

You are also right that I pop up every now and again, and may disappear again soon.

I only wanted to help steer the ping-pong match between you two to a conclusion. It was getting boring, if nothing else.

But then you are also right that Galv should have the courage to say: “yes, this is what I believe - only members of the JWs can be subject to Jesus and his Kingdom” (if this is what he actually believes. )

However, my point is then - so what? Many, if not most, posters here have a particular set of beliefs which they think are of fundamental importance for salvation. For example, I have already mentioned that for some like sonship and kelly I am not a Christian, not one of their inner circle which have heaven all to themselves. So what? That is their belief.

So I am happy to discuss any subject with JWs, Buddhists, Christian Fundamentalists (although that is sometimes the most difficult...) and maybe even learn something. But there should be an understanding of the frame of reference of the discussion.

If your issue is to establish the sincerity and believability of such a frame of reference with Galv, (for example pointing out discrepancies between opinions previously stated) then your request is certainly valid.

@caljust said
.But then you are also right that Galv should have the courage to say: “yes, this is what I believe - only members of the JWs can be subject to Jesus and his Kingdom” (if this is what he actually believes. )

However, my point is then - so what?

You agree that Galveston75 should have the “courage” to respond honestly on a discussion forum board where integrity and principle are centric to discussion progression and individual credibility...and then you say “so what?”

@fmf said
If nothing else look at the first word in the first paragraph. There is the answer you all want so much, and it's the one that was in this post all along!!

From your link: "No. Many millions who lived in centuries past and who weren’t Jehovah’s Witnesses will have an opportunity for salvation."

What about people LIVING NOW (never mind those who lived in centur ...[text shortened]... like it was written by a furtive corporate lawyer who is trying to obfuscate his employer's policy.

Take it all as you want and understand. My answer is clearly "no" and has always been no.
Neither myself or the Witnesses wrote the bible. It says what it says. It has laws for all humans and commands from Jehovah and his son Jesus.
Now it is up to everyone of us to either do what it says or we don't. Some decide to pick out certain things that fits their life and that is fine. Everyone here is free to do as they see fit.
But we as a group decide in a most serious degree to follow the direction Jesus gave to all his followers when he was here as a human at that time.
We seriously believe the world as we know it to an extreme degree that Armageddon is very close and as the bible says most that do not follow God in the way he says in the bible, will lose their life at that time.
We believe Jesus and follow what he said to do and that is to warn all that will listen about this Armageddon that the Bible has described.
We didn't write the bible but we take it very seriously as the word of God himself. But for doing that and doing things such as the door to door teaching work, we get ridicule from many just like Rajk does for example.
Makes no sense but it happens often by many who don't agree in us doing that...
And we will continue until we are told to stop....

@galveston75 said
Take it all as you want and understand. My answer is clearly "no" and has always been no.
Neither myself or the Witnesses wrote the bible. It says what it says. It has laws for all humans and commands from Jehovah and his son Jesus.
Now it is up to everyone of us to either do what it says or we don't. Some decide to pick out certain things that fits their life and t ...[text shortened]... ten by many who don't agree in us doing that...
And we will continue until we are told to stop....

If, during your 'door to door teaching,' you encounter a person who is clearly vulnerable, perhaps with mental health issues, do you walk away with dignity or view such a person as an easy convert?

And if you do walk away (personally) what is your view of any JWs who don't and who elect instead to manipulate such a vulnerable individual?

@galveston75 said
Take it all as you want and understand.

@Caljust watch this...

Fourth time of asking Galveston75;

In reference to your post the other day:
Is it possible to be “subject to Jesus and his Kingdom” as you describe it there, without being a member of the Jehovah’s Witness church?

Yes or no?

@ghost-of-a-duke said
If, during your 'door to door teaching,' you encounter a person who is clearly vulnerable, perhaps with mental health issues, do you walk away with dignity or view such a person as an easy convert?

And if you do walk away (personally) what is your view of any JWs who don't and who elect instead to manipulate such a vulnerable individual?

What? It's a strange question but no I've never seen any JW take advantage as you say of anyone like that.
And what do you mean as an easy convert? Are you suggesting were out to get a quota or something?

@galveston75 said
We didn't write the bible

Well actually you did, your own version of it, the New World Translation.

@galveston75 said
We seriously believe the world as we know it to an extreme degree that Armageddon is very close

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watch_Tower_Society_unfulfilled_predictions

You should read this and learn from the past false prophesies of your church leaders.

@galveston75 said
Now it is up to everyone of us to either do what it says or we don't. Some decide to pick out certain things that fits their life and that is fine. Everyone here is free to do as they see fit.
But we as a group decide in a most serious degree to follow the direction Jesus gave to all his followers when he was here as a human at that time.

If a JW parent decides to withhold a blood transfusion from their relative or child and the person dies, have they done what the bible, your versions of Jehovah and Jesus says?

Or...if they decide NOT to withhold blood, have they been “free to decide to do as they see fit”?

@galveston75 said
Take it all as you want and understand. My answer is clearly "no" and has always been no.
Neither myself or the Witnesses wrote the bible. It says what it says. It has laws for all humans and commands from Jehovah and his son Jesus.
Now it is up to everyone of us to either do what it says or we don't. Some decide to pick out certain things that fits their life and t ...[text shortened]... ten by many who don't agree in us doing that...
And we will continue until we are told to stop....

You asked me to read a paragraph. I did. I critiqued it. It was carefully - deceptively - written. I explained why. So I did what you said. And now you are blanking out the content of my reply?

@galveston75 said
We seriously believe the world as we know it to an extreme degree that Armageddon is very close and as the bible says most that do not follow God in the way he says in the bible, will lose their life at that time.

And you will surely remember when we discussed this in detail and I presented you with quotes from your Watchtower magazine that clearly stated that only members of the Jehovah's Witnesses will survive "Armageddon". Surely you remember? I do.

After pages and pages of you demanding to see the quotes, when I showed them to you, you then abruptly disappeared for 2-3 months. You surely haven't forgotten.

@fmf said
And you will surely remember when we discussed this in detail and I presented you with quotes from your Watchtower magazine that clearly stated that only members of the Jehovah's Witnesses will survive "Armageddon". Surely you remember? I do.

After pages and pages of you demanding to see the quotes, when I showed them to you, you then abruptly disappeared for 2-3 months. You surely haven't forgotten.

I've never disappeared as you say because of anything I've read of anything posted here. I've left a few times because of the crap thrown at me because of my beliefs. Yes I'm proud of being a JW but I'm still human which is something a few including you seem to forget and apparently enjoy dogging me as well as a couple others here.
So forgive me for leaving at times. But during this last couple years my mother died, my sister disappeared from all of us for a year for very selfish reasons and I didn't know if she was dead or alive, my father has tried to kill himself twice from depression, I have had three surgeries and still need more which one is a serious surgery that I'm scared to death to do.
So these are my problems not yours or anyone's here. But give me a break when I get tired of all the crap that happens here.
I love talking about God and would love for this to be a place I can do it. But some of you view this forum as something else that's not good for anyone's enjoyment.

@divegeester said
You agree that Galveston75 should have the “courage” to respond honestly on a discussion forum board where integrity and principle are centric to discussion progression and individual credibility...and then you say “so what?”

My: so what? response is aimed at whatever answer you receive to your question. It does by no means imply that it is unimportant whether people reply truthfully or evasively or not.

If I asked you directly: do you believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster (remember that?) and you said "yes!" , what do I then do with that knowledge? Should I ridicule you? Or is it merely one more piece of information about you that I can put in my data bank.

@galveston75 said
I've never disappeared as you say because of anything I've read of anything posted here. I've left a few times because of the crap thrown at me because of my beliefs. Yes I'm proud of being a JW but I'm still human which is something a few including you seem to forget and apparently enjoy dogging me as well as a couple others here.
So forgive me for leaving at times. B ...[text shortened]... an do it. But some of you view this forum as something else that's not good for anyone's enjoyment.

You have blanked out the content of the post you are ostensibly replying to.